Medieval Era v4 released!

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e_i_pi
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Medieval Era v4 released!

Postby e_i_pi » Mon Nov 14, 2016 11:07 am

Medieval Era v4 has been released. This release concentrated on attaining a bit more balance in sieges, both by land and by sea. The discussion thread lists the changes, but in brief the major changes are:
  • Minor imbalances in favour of defender addressed in land sieges. Main change is that Scale the Walls is now prevented by a Cavalry being inside the fort (i.e. the attacker must risk their Siege Engine via a Ram the Gates attack if the defender has a defending cavalry)
  • Major imbalances in favour of the defender addressed in beach/sea sieges. Primarily, the attackers first Navy now gets a +1 bonus, and the defenders second Navy can now be killed
  • Major imbalances in favour of the defender addressed in Raids/Bombardments. Primarily, the attackers first and/or second navy now get a +1 bonus


nixie
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Re: Medieval Era v4 released!

Postby nixie » Wed Nov 16, 2016 1:32 am

Only thought of this last night however would it be possible for defending siege units to be destroyed. Its very strange that everything else can be destroyed but sieges can't.

I'm slightly concerned about the first change in the list below. Seems to me this could swing the balance towards the defender quite a bit. In theory yes you should loose less infantry using ram the gates however it has always seemed to me that the siege engines get destroyed rather too easily. Also given the cavalry cannot be attacked unit almost all the defending infantry has gone your going to be force into only using ram the gates for a large proportion of the time.

nixie
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Re: Medieval Era v4 released!

Postby nixie » Wed Nov 16, 2016 4:27 am

Further thoughts on the loss rate of siege engines when using Ram the gates.Although I can't prove it at the moment I've a strong suspicion that sieges get destroyed when they shouldn't.

A question - what happens (which is chosen to be destroyed) when 2 unit types have the same role?

So 'Ram the gates' 1 siege and 4 infantry attacking - 1 castle and 3 infantry defending. All attackers role a 2 (siege roles a 1 + 1 bonus). All defenders role >=3. So attackers need to loose 3 units.

  • Do all of these losses come from the lesser units?
  • or is there a random allocation of the losses
  • something else

Also how do the dice roles match up. When a unit has a role high enough to mean it causes damage how is that damage allocated? Does it take out the lowest role on the opposition side?

I will try to collect some evidence of my suspicions as at the moment its a hunch that there is a bug somewhere.

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e_i_pi
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Re: Medieval Era v4 released!

Postby e_i_pi » Wed Nov 16, 2016 10:21 am

nixie wrote:Only thought of this last night however would it be possible for defending siege units to be destroyed. Its very strange that everything else can be destroyed but sieges can't.

I'm slightly concerned about the first change in the list below. Seems to me this could swing the balance towards the defender quite a bit. In theory yes you should loose less infantry using ram the gates however it has always seemed to me that the siege engines get destroyed rather too easily. Also given the cavalry cannot be attacked unit almost all the defending infantry has gone your going to be force into only using ram the gates for a large proportion of the time.

With Scale the Walls, the attacker now gets an extra die, making that attack slightly more effective. That needed to be done. The imbalance was small, but needed addressing.

As for Ram The Gates now being the only attack available for an attacker against a 1-2 size fort with a Cavalry, here's my reasoning. The defender needed some way to prevent the attacker using a Siege Engine without risk. The cost of this is a Cavalry which has to stay in the fort, which is 100g down the gurgler for a defensive troop. Considering forts cost ~125g, if you have 2 forts, you're probably going to bump it up to 3. Mind you, if you have 1 fort, this tactic makes it easier to defend, and allows you to keep your cavalry somewhere without them being risked as much (as the attacker will eventually run out of siege engines against a fort with 12-24 infantry). The downside of keeping cavalry in a fort is they get no bonus to their attack die. In the open field, they get +1 no matter what, in a siege they get 0.

nixie wrote:Further thoughts on the loss rate of siege engines when using Ram the gates.Although I can't prove it at the moment I've a strong suspicion that sieges get destroyed when they shouldn't.

A question - what happens (which is chosen to be destroyed) when 2 unit types have the same role?

So 'Ram the gates' 1 siege and 4 infantry attacking - 1 castle and 3 infantry defending. All attackers role a 2 (siege roles a 1 + 1 bonus). All defenders role >=3. So attackers need to loose 3 units.

  • Do all of these losses come from the lesser units?
  • or is there a random allocation of the losses
  • something else

Also how do the dice roles match up. When a unit has a role high enough to mean it causes damage how is that damage allocated? Does it take out the lowest role on the opposition side?

I will try to collect some evidence of my suspicions as at the moment its a hunch that there is a bug somewhere.

You can check this by hovering the mouse over the dice after the battle. It actually gives you information on who killed who. In regards to the losses, they dice are matched up strongest to weakest. Look at the following:

Attacker siege rolls 6, infantry roll 5, 4, 3, 1
Defender rolls 6, 5, 3, 2

Attacker 6 vs Defender 6 (attacker loses)
Attacker 5 vs Defender 5 (attacker loses)
Attacker 4 vs Defender 3 (defender loses)
Attacker 3 vs Defender 2 (defender loses)
Attacker 1 is "spare" and doesn't take part in the battle

So in this case, the siege engine is lost, even though it rolled the highest.

In light of this, and the fact that siege engines cost so much, what I'll do is change all the land/beach siege battles to have their first siege engine an additional +1 to their die, and their first attacking infantry to have -1 to their die to balance it. This should make the siege engines more resilient. In the example above, the siege would then be at 7, and not be killed.

nixie
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Re: Medieval Era v4 released!

Postby nixie » Thu Nov 17, 2016 4:21 am

Ok, that make sense. I hadn't noticed the mouse over information as I mostly play on my phone.

What would happen in this similar case (difference from yours is the first infantry dice)?

Attacker siege rolls 6, infantry roll 6, 4, 3, 1
Defender rolls 6, 5, 3, 2

One of the siege or infantry is going to win and the other loose. If you match the strongest dice up you have to decide which of the 2 strongest attacking dice to use first. How is this decided?

Thanks for the change, will be interesting to see how it works in a game.

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e_i_pi
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Re: Medieval Era v4 released!

Postby e_i_pi » Thu Nov 17, 2016 8:50 am

I first tried to implement it as "sort by highest roll, then by lowest cost", so that infantry would take hits before cavalry or siege. But, I couldn't get it to sort properly, not sure why. Was probably under a bit of stress at the time, with screaming kids and what not, so just went with "sort by highest roll", and then randomly allocate the casualty. I'll pop that on the to-do list as an enhancement.

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e_i_pi
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Re: Medieval Era v4 released!

Postby e_i_pi » Thu Nov 17, 2016 8:56 am



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